COVID, cannabis, schools, racism: House candidates share differing - and some provocative - views in forum
Candidates for the two Vermont house seats in the Washington-Chittenden district shared their differing and at times provocative views on campaign issues in a forum Monday hosted by the Waterbury Roundabout and WDEV AM-FM.
The legislative district includes Waterbury in Washington County and Bolton, Huntington and Buel’s Gore in Chittenden County. Incumbent Reps. Tom Stevens and Theresa Wood, both Democrats from Waterbury, were joined by political newcomer Brock Coderre, a Waterbury Republican, and Chris Viens, the current chair of the Waterbury Select Board running as an Independent.
Lisa Scagliotti of the Waterbury Roundabout and Ric Cengeri of WDEV Morning News Service co-moderated the event held online and on the radio.
The discussion covered issues related to the COVID-19 pandemic, Vermont’s new cannabis legislation, representing communities beyond their hometown of Waterbury and more. In some cases the candidates’ views had common themes, and in others there were clear differences. One question submitted by a voter who asked about addressing racism elicited answers that revealed sharp contrasts among the candidates.
The forum began with a question about Vermont’s response to the COVID-19 pandemic and whether the candidates thought it has been lacking in any way.
Stevens, who is seeking his seventh term in the House, praised Vermont’s bipartisan response in managing allocating $1.25 billion from the federal CARES Act. He also highlighted Vermont’s attention to homeless individuals, stating, “There were over 2,000 Vermonters who, in the immediate aftermath of shutting down the state, needed places [to stay]. We were able to put together packages that kept people off the streets,” he said.
Wood also noted the cooperation in managing federal aid. “You’d be surprised about how difficult it is to responsibly allocate and spend over a billion dollars in a very short period of time,” she said, adding. “I feel like we fell back on the local-control mantra for guidance given to our schools. We could have been as a state more proactive on the school side of things.” Wood is running for her third term after her appointment to her House seat in 2015.
Viens criticized Vermont’s response, saying the state used federal money to prop up failing institutions such as state colleges and some government programs. “It was fine to consider bailing those institutions out, but they were already bleeding at the seams,” he said. He said that mismanagement of revenue sources needed to be addressed before the next outbreak.
Coderre agreed with Viens that the pandemic has illuminated some ongoing issues in the state. “I do think Vermont is a bit of an expensive state. Efficiency seems to be not our strongest suit,” he said. Coderre suggested that the state rely less on tourism in the future. Instead it should focus on increasing support for Vermont businesses and products “in an attempt to increase revenue from inside the state without relying on having people from other locations coming here and spending their money.”
How do restaurants, tourism, etc. navigate the pandemic
The candidates were asked if the state should help businesses in the hospitality industry get back on their feet post-pandemic, and if so, how.
Wood said there will be a role for state government to assist the travel and tourism industry to help it rebound, partly because the state does rely on it for revenue. She mentioned an ongoing program that provides business support services such as web design and also pays in-state companies to be those resources for Vermont travel and tourism companies.
Viens said he understands the importance of tourism to Vermont, noting that he worked in the ski industry growing up in Fayston. He said there should help for tourist-dependent businesses “without damaging the rest of the economics of the state” and suggested increasing the gas tax as a revenue source to help bolster the tourism sector.
Coderre said he supports “any government helping a victim in any sense of the word” and small businesses regardless of their industry have all been impacted by COVID. He said he would support more assistance to “restaurants on every corner” and other small businesses. While unemployment and aid to workers affected by COVID shutdowns were helpful, Coderre said small businesses could benefit from more government relief.
Stevens said there are limits to what government can do. “There’s not enough money in Vermont state coffers to offer direct assistance to everybody all the time,” he said. He pointed out though how the state has helped businesses in other ways such as assisting restaurants as they navigated opening under COVID restrictions by allowing for selling alcohol curbside to generate more income. “We are helping people as best we can with the funds that are available to us and through changing programs that we have to benefit the service industry,” Stevens said.
Schools in the pandemic
The candidates were asked whether Vermont’s education officials and school districts should push for more uniform approaches for operating schools in the pandemic rather than the wide variety of plans in place since September.
Viens said he had advocated for hybrid learning prior to the pandemic. He argued that average Vermont homeowners cannot keep up with the tax burden that public education places on them. He criticized how the legislature “throws out” what he called “should-work scenarios” like Act 46, the state law passed in 2015 that called for school districts to consolidate. “Part of the solution is getting information from the schools to find out if what’s working is working. If it isn’t, then we need to sit down and restructure basic needs on more of a standard platform for the entire school system.”
Coderre said he supports districts deciding their plans. “I think that the people in an area should decide for themselves what’s best for them,” he said. “Districts should be able to decide for themselves what works for them.” He suggested more public forums as a way to open up conversation around the issue.
Stevens commended school teachers for the “incredibly superhuman job” they’ve done in reopening during the pandemic. He cautioned that while input from individual districts is important, the state constitution requires Vermont to provide equal access to education. “There are standards that the state needs to put across in order to make sure that the students in the most difficult conditions are learning in a way they find best and they’re not left behind,” he said.
Wood, a former longtime school board member, agreed that equal access to education is critical but cautioned that there’s no “one-size-fits-all” answer. She laid out the conundrum: “Vermonters when it comes to education kind of want to have things both ways. They want to have the integral flexibility of what they perceive as local control, and yet during stressful times like a pandemic they want more guidance from the state. I think we need to balance those things.”
Moving ahead with a legal cannabis industry
Candidates were next asked about cannabis legislation that recently was enacted into law and whether communities in the district should consider authorizing cannabis businesses.
Viens, a vocal opponent of legal cannabis, said he was “deeply upset and troubled by the abuse of products that seem to have too much control over the human population.” He referenced friends dealing with employees with drug problems. “I see the goodness of people being ruined by abuse of substances,” he said. He accused lawmakers of moving forward with the cannabis bill for economic reasons and “preying on people’s weaknesses to try and bail us out of our financial problems.”
Speaking after Viens, Wood explained that “there is no cash cow in [the bill].” She pointed out that the law devotes money to prevention and education of drug misuse. Overall, Wood said, the previous system didn’t make sense to allow possession of cannabis while outlawing its sale, limiting possessors to only those who grow cannabis themselves. She also noted the importance of racial and social justice issues associated with people in the correctional system as a result of cannabis.
Stevens pointed out that 70,000 to 80,000 Vermonters regularly smoke marijuana, and that the best way to prevent substance abuse is regulation. “When my kids were in high school, they could get marijuana just about every day if they wanted to, but they couldn’t get liquor,” he said. He also brought up the racial inequities surrounding cannabis use, especially with regards to law enforcement.
Coderre said he liked how the law allows for local decision-making. “I think it's important that towns … they all need to decide for themselves whether or not they want the businesses around,” he said. Coderre agreed with Stevens in that the best way to prevent substance abuse is state regulation, but he said he still worries about youth substance abuse. He said he thinks Vermont is “on a good path by basically ending the prohibition of marijuana sales,” but he wants more information, specifically on the 20% tax the new law outlines, which seems expensive to him.
Candidates pose questions
The forum next had candidates ask each other questions.
Wood asked Viens if he could talk more about his ideas to make Waterbury – and Vermont in general – more affordable.
Viens said that the influx of out-of-state home buyers has driven up the cost of taxes and also prevented in-state potential homeowners from buying their own homes. He mentioned that government officials are afforded pay hikes every year, but private sector employees only see raises once every three to seven years. He said he doesn’t find it fair that taxpayers are asked to fund raises for government workers.
Coderre then asked Stevens if it would be possible to give money to restaurant workers and others in the service industry to minimize the economic impact of COVID-19 on their livelihoods.
Stevens said that over 140,000 Vermonters make less that $27,000 a year, which is higher than what most restaurant workers make on average. He said that up until July 30, anybody who was laid off across the whole workforce received their unemployment checks in addition to a $600 per week benefit, and the legislature just passed a measure that would give anybody still on unemployment an extra $300 a week, as long as the money is available.
In one of the event’s most passionate exchanges, Stevens posed his question to Viens: “You’ve talked in years past about the importance of being a real Vermonter.… Some might say I’m an Ethan Allan Vermonter, I was born in Connecticut. So what does it mean to you to be a real Vermonter? Do Black lives matter to you? Does racial equity matter to you? Do people who are suffering from poverty matter to you?"
Saying he wished for more time to answer, Viens used his full two minutes: “I’m the type of person that believes that if you want to be a good community member, you want to get a job to the best of your ability, you want to participate in being friends with your neighbors, helping wherever you can help and just being an overall good citizen … I don’t care what color you are. I don’t care.” On being a real Vermonter, Viens said, “I’m a big believer in life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, but Thomas Jefferson forgot to put one thing in the Constitution. That was life liberty and the pursuit of happiness – but not at somebody else’s expense.” Viens criticized what he called state “entitlement” programs, using an example of individuals with disabilities. “I know there’s people out there that desperately need help... but there’s a fine line between needing help and just plain not wanting to do anything and expecting a handout.”
Viens then asked Stevens why teachers unions aren’t a concern of the legislature, why the government hasn’t realized efficiencies from investments in new technology, and why the government is growing and continuing to spend money on programs that aren’t providing a return on the investment.
Stevens replied that Vermonters get something from taxes paid for public schools. “Our public education system is one of the best in the country. Our children are receiving a public education that far exceeds most of the country,” Stevens said, adding that unions are important given that tax dollars fund education.
Stevens disagreed about state spending on technology pointing out how the COVID-19 pandemic revealed one area in need of upgrading. “Eighty thousand Vermonters went unemployed in a heartbeat and our system which was based on a system that was used when you and I were in high school was what we were still using,” he said. “So, no, we haven't invested in the kind of efficiencies that we want to see and it's disappointing.”
How to make all feel ‘welcome and safe’
A Waterbury Roundabout reader wrote in with a question saying he had attended various racial justice rallies and heard people of color tell of their experiences with racism in Vermont and in the community. “It is apparent we have work to do to make all feel welcome here. I would like to know what each candidate will do to work towards making people of all races feel welcome and safe in their represented area and Vermont as a whole.”
Wood said that she had attended demonstrations and meetings of the newly formed Waterbury Anti-Racism Coalition. “To hear children speak about their fears and how they are treated by other students or other people in the community and to see the real anxiety that it causes for people is really heartbreaking frankly,” she said. “I grew up in Vermont and we all know Vermont is a very white state and I have taken the time to begin to try to understand what it really feels like to be a person of color in this state … and it is difficult.” She then mentioned recent legislation to help address racial inequalities, specifically bills related to policing and a study in the correctional system about looking at the inequities people of color face in the correctional system.
Calling himself “a very constitutional thinker,” Coderre said, “To me, the Constitution was written to protect everyone, every single person that sets foot in the United States. They are protected by the Constitution just for being here.” He suggested emphasizing teaching civics in schools as a way to encourage students to be more engaged with politics, discuss what it means to be an American, and learn how to disagree civilly. Eventually, discussion of race won’t be needed, Coderre said. “I think we should just stop talking about race in general, because if it’s not on your mind and you’re not talking about it, then you can’t treat people differently because of it,” he said.
Stevens took a different tack. “Simply saying ‘Black Lives Matter’ isn’t enough. Of course they matter. And we have to show that not only that they matter, but they matter because the systems that we’ve promulgated, that we’ve lived under for the last 400 years in this country, less than that in Vermont, are pretty systematically racist in their construction,” he said. “We have to find out what being an anti-racist means. It’s not just saying live and let live.” Addressing the inequality in our system and culture that has existed for Black people in America for centuries will require not handouts, Stevens said. A start will mean both a maturity in thinking around these issues along with increasing economic opportunities, he added.
Viens said that he would like minority community members to offer a list of issues that need to be resolved. He denounced the recent Vermont protests against police brutality and suggested an alternative to calls to defund police: "I'd rather see a segregated police. I'd rather see more minorities brought into the police department. When calls come out that are minority-related, those police officers that are of minority will address those issues," he said. “That way it would solve I would hope one thing if there is a tragic shooting – The whole racist issue might be put to rest because you have a minority police officer dealing with a minority issue."
Viens said he would encourage anti-racism protesters to help create a platform to address inequities. “To continue to blame Vermont for mostly being a mostly white state is kind of a slap in the face. That’s just the way things evolved. It wasn’t on purpose,” Viens said. “I think that there’s plenty of work to be done. Rather than tearing down people's buildings and screaming at each other, let’s put a platform together. Let’s act on it. Let’s move it in a better direction.”
How to represent the Chittenden County communities
The final question asked how these four residents of Waterbury would represent the other towns in the district as well as their hometown.
“I’m going to keep doing what I always do, which is to make sure that I reach out to the communities,” Stevens said, explaining how he would deal with constituents as they come forward and as he seeks them out. He acknowledged that it can be challenging when people in each town hold differing views, offering the example of Act 46, the school consolidation law, as an example. It’s important to work with people in each community directly, learn who they are, and what’s important to them, Stevens said.
Coderre held up a notepad and said that he’s been visiting the communities in the district, “walking around and talking to complete strangers,” getting to know people and taking notes.
Viens pointed to his experience on the Waterbury Select Board as preparation for serving in the House, pointing out that he’s helped change past practices and prioritied in town government, As a result, the town is doing more paving projects than it has in 25 years, he said.
Wood spoke from experience. “When we’re elected, you’re elected to represent everybody. It doesn’t matter your party. It doesn’t matter where you live. It doesn't matter whether you contact us or we contact you. So that's what I would continue to do is to represent everyone. We won’t always agree .... but it's important that people know that they have a voice in Montpelier.
